Episode 3- Strength Training- Myths, misconceptions, and application for distance runners

好了，欢迎来到《马格尼斯与马库斯的教练课》第三集。

Okay, welcome to episode three of Magness and Marcus on Coaching.

和往常一样，我今天和约翰·马库斯在一起。

I'm here with John Marcus as always.

希望你们喜欢前两期，咱们继续往下聊，保持轻松的氛围，再谈个新话题。

Hope you guys had enjoyed the first two episodes and we're just gonna keep at it and keep the vibe light and jump into another topic.

约翰，你最近怎么样？

How are you doing, John?

我很好，史蒂夫。

Doing great, Steve.

能回来真不错。

Good to be back.

好，很好，太好了。

Good, good, good.

说到这个，我特别想聊的一个话题，就是我们打算深入探讨的——力量训练，或者叫重量训练，反正就是这么个说法。

Well, in discussing things, the topic which I'm really excited about that we figured we'd delve into is basically weight training, strength training, for lack of a better term.

我一直在想，你是不是想先抛个话题，比如聊聊力量训练和长跑运动员之间的一些争议？

I was wondering if you wanted to get the ball rolling and maybe start with some controversy on strength and distance runners.

依我经验，教练和运动员最常担心的就是：一旦让长跑运动员去练力量，他们就会变得肌肉发达。

I think the, you know, biggest controversy that typically comes to coaches' minds, even some athletes' minds, at least from my experience, is, like, if you get in the weight room, your distance runners are gonna get bulky.

体型会变大。

They're gonna get bigger.

全身堆满肌肉。

They're put on us all this muscle mass.

这样会拖慢他们的速度，最大摄氧量会下降，效率也会大幅降低，毕竟体重太重了。

That thing's gonna slow them down, you know, and their, you know, velocity of the o two max is gonna decline and suffer, and their efficiency is just gonna go, you know, way, way, way, way down because they're too heavy.

我听过太多教练说：‘我可不敢让他们练太多。’

I hear that so many times when coaches, oh, I don't I shouldn't let that much.

我们可不想练得太壮。

We don't wanna get too bulky.

其实这不过是训练工具箱里的一种工具，关键是怎么用、怎么融入日常训练中。

So, you know, it's another tool in your toolkit or in toolbox, so to speak, about how you use that, how you integrate that into your training.

因为如果你明白从耐力跑者的角度出发，力量训练的目标是什么，以及如何把它和跑步训练合理搭配，那它就能带来非常积极、长远的影响。

Because if you understand what the goal is from a distance runner's perspective to get the strength training stuff going, and sequencing it in with your running training, then it can have, you know, great empowering, impactful long term effects.

所以我觉得我们该做的，就是把这一点说清楚。

So I think that's what we wanna do is just kinda clear up

把事情讲明白。

the air or unlock up the waters.

现在这些说法还比较模糊。

They're a little gray right now.

是的。

Yeah.

没错。

Definitely.

说起来挺有意思的。

You know, it's funny.

我读硕士的时候，我的导师是一位很有名的力量训练专家，但他总喜欢跟我开玩笑。

So when I was getting my master's, one of the or my adviser was a a big kinda strength training guru, but he always liked to to joke around with me.

我们花那么多时间，就为了让力量型运动员稍微壮一点。

It's like, Man, we spend all this time trying to figure out how to get slightly bigger for his strength guys.

该做的都做了，结果进步却微乎其微。

It's like, We do everything right, and we're talking minuscule improvement.

要增肌得付出那么多努力。

And we have to do so much to gain mass.

可你们这些长跑选手，每周跑六七十甚至八九百公里，却担心每周抽两次、每次一小时的力量训练，会把你练得肌肉暴涨——其实哪有那么容易。

And it's like here you distance runners are who are running sixty, seventy, 8,100 miles a week, and you're worried about going in there twice a week, doing some lifting, and you're worried about this thing that might take an hour of your total ten, twelve hours week of work of suddenly blowing you up and making you huge like it's easy.

他说得真有道理。

And he made a great point.

没错，你说得对。

I'm like, yeah, you're right.

想长肌肉哪有那么简单。

It's not that easy to get big.

更何况，你天生就是长跑选手的体质，想长肌肉更难了。

And it's definitely not that easy to get big when most of the time you have the genetics of a distance runner.

所以第一点是，你真得主动去增肌。

So I think that's number one is you actually have to try to put on bulk.

这不是你只要开始举铁就会自动发生的，这种担心总是存在的。

It's not something that magically automatically happens when you just start lifting weights, which is always always a fear.

没错。

Exactly.

你得特别用心，比如大量摄入蛋白质、肌酸这些东西，这确实是在增重，但肌酸只是让身体多存点水，真正要的是提升力量，而不是单纯增加体重。

And you have to be very conscientious, like, you know, really fucking down exuberant amounts of protein, creatine, all these types of things, and that, you know, is, you know, bulk because creatine just help hold it at water retention to create more mass, but it doesn't get at what we're trying to create, which is more power.

关键的区别在于分清增重、增肌和真正提升每一步的爆发力之间的不同。

I think that's that's the key differential is looking between what's bulk, what's mass and what's actually creating more power per stride in a runner.

还有就是，要强化大脑和肌肉之间的神经连接，把这层关系真正建立起来。

And also too, just enhancing that bio learning mechanism between the brain and the muscles and really just getting that.

让这些神经通路不断快速放电，像打鼓一样密集。

So those synapses are going boom boom boom and firing at high speeds.

所以到最后冲刺阶段，尤其是800米或1500米，这种协调性带来的优势，远比你光做平板支撑和核心训练要强得多。

So then you're just this coordination effect at the end of a race, especially like the 800 or 1,500 isn't as high as if you're just sitting there doing a bunch of planks and core circuits.

没错。

Exactly.

我觉得我们得摆脱这种想法：很多人以为只要练点轻量级的普通力量，就像弗恩·甘贝塔常跟我说的‘垃圾力量’那样。

And I think that's what we need to get away from is I think a lot of times, people have this conception of really lightweight kind of general strength, or as as Vern Gambetta likes to tell me garbage strength

对。

Right.

是的。

Yeah.

在健身房随便练练，就觉得万事大吉了。

In the weight room and just hit that up and all will be good.

但事实上，我们的想法是一致的：你追求的是哪怕短跑运动员也会想要的那种适应性变化。

When the reality is, I I mean, we're on the same page, is that you're looking to generate some of the same adaptations that even a sprinter would want.

我们追求的是爆发力。

We're looking at power.

为什么？

Why?

因为如果我们能稍微增加对地面的施力，并具备这种能力，就能提升效率，也有助于改善这些神经层面的适应。

Because if we can impact slightly more force into that ground and have that ability to, then it's going to help with efficiency, it's going to help with some of these neural components.

这能带来根本性的改变。

It's a game changer.

没错，关键在于理解不同训练方式引发的激素反应，这非常重要。这正是拥有力量与体能认证和真正掌握专业知识之间的区别，而不是那种在LA Fitness常见的、只拿了个在线开卷考试证书的普通健身教练——他们花五百块考个证，通过了就能上岗。

Exactly, and I think that's the key thing, is understanding the hormonal response that's happening with different types of lifting protocols is critical and that's where it's the difference between having a strength and conditioning certificate or having that intimate knowledge versus kind of more of that personal trainer that you have at LA Fitness, you know, that just has kind of this very generic, very, hey, we paid $500 to take this test, open book test online, pass you through so you can start being, this kind of personal trainer.

所以，这涉及更高层次的专业性。尤其是激素反应，比如你在大重量训练前、训练后、训练后几小时内做这些动作，都至关重要。它不仅能帮助提升整体运动表现，不只是强化我们想重点发展的后链肌群——腘绳肌、臀肌、髋部和股四头肌，还能让运动员更好地适应跑道上的训练负荷，把力量房的训练效果和田径场上的表现结合起来，推动他们进步，最终达到我所说的‘人生最佳体能状态’——就是那种运动员跑来跟你说：教练，我现在状态是我这辈子最好的时候。

So, it's a little bit different degree of sophistication because those hormonal responses especially where you place them in your training before a heavy workout, after a heavy workout, how many hours you're doing that or after a hard bout is really critical because it can help enhance the entire athlete, not only of firm up those big primary movers that we want to really address there in on the backside of the chain there, the hamstrings, glutes, you know, hips and quads, but also too, just making sure that we're preparing the athlete to absorb that training effect on the track and combining it with the effect you want to see in the weight room to move them forward and get them to where ultimately we want to be, which is that what I call the happy land of best fitness of my life syndrome, where it's like, coach, I'm the best fitness of my life.

我刚在一万米和八百米上都刷新了个人最好成绩。

I'm doing I ran a PR on the 10 k and I in the 800.

我听了就说，没错。

I'm like, yeah.

这就是我的人生巅峰状态。

That's my life syndrome.

能处在这种状态，真的很棒。

It's a happy place to be.

只要在跑道上突破个人最好成绩，就值得庆祝。

Anything you step on track with PR.

这种正向的反馈能持续激发运动员的积极状态和好心情。

And that's the kind of thing that keeps, you know, positive momentum and good vibes for every athlete moving forward.

没错。

Exactly.

说到激素系统，我本人特别着迷这一块。

You know, when you when you talk about hormonal system, I mean, I love that stuff first off.

我第一个想到的就是艾伦·韦伯，咱们俩都认识他，也跟他合作过。

But the first name that comes to my mind and someone we who we've both, who we both call friends and have worked with is is Alan Webb.

你看看他当年在弗吉尼亚跟斯科特·拉斯基训练时，力量训练方案让他体内形成了超强的合成代谢环境，无论是在跑道上还是其他地方，他都能快速恢复。

Because if you looked at what he was doing, with Scott Rasco out in Virginia, is his strength program set him up so that he had this monstrous anabolic profile that made it where he could bounce back and recover from so much, whether on the track or off the track.

我在研究生时期帮他训练时，第一件事就注意到，我们刚做完一场高强度的跑道训练，他立马去力量房做一系列挺举、深蹲或者抓举，重量还不轻，但他一点事都没有。

One of the first things I noticed when out in grad school training for him is we'd go do some pretty hectic hard track session and then right afterwards he'd go into the weight room and do a series of Olympic lifts, squats or cleans or whatever have you with pretty heavy weight and he'd be fine.

第二天他又能生龙活虎地回来训练。

The next day he'd come back, bounce back.

我还记得第一次做这些训练的时候，我可是个在大学里每周跑120英里的人，心想：这点事儿算什么。

I remember the first time I did this, and I'm coming from a guy who ran up to 120 miles a week in college thinking, Oh, I can handle anything.

我完全扛得住。

I'm good to go.

第一次连续做完田径训练接着去举重，我直接瘫了。

The first time I went through these sessions of track and then weight, I was toast.

但经过几个月甚至更久的坚持，我的身体慢慢适应了，突然之间，我在举重和跑道上的表现都大幅提升。

But after months and months of doing this, my body adapted and all of a sudden, I was handling, much more not only in the weight room, but on the track.

没错。

Right.

就是这样。

Exactly.

这种全身性的适应，不只是从宏观上看跑步和非跑步训练怎么配合，更重要的是运动员那种日积月累、一年一年的缓慢进步，真的特别关键。

And that's, you know, that global adaptation not only in that macro perspective about how everything combines from the running to the non running work you're doing, but also too, that patient improvement of, you know, season to season, year to year with an athlete is really important.

你回头跟艾伦聊他的训练，就会发现，正是这套安排让他在某一年突然爆发，跑出了27分多的10公里，第二年又打破了美国一英里纪录。

Guess one thing when you look back and talk to Alan about, like, his training, that set him up for, you know, that magical kind of year where he ran, you know, that 27, you know, mid and the 10 k, and then the following year, broke the American record in the mile.

他当时正处于训练量累积的阶段，体内的激素水平高得惊人。

He had just gone through an accumulation standpoint, and there's so much of that that his hormonal profile was off the charts.

你甚至可以看看他过去几年的血液检测报告。

And you even look at through his blood work in the last several years.

简直就像他一辈子都生活在高海拔地区一样。

I mean, it's it's like the guy has been at altitude his whole life.

因为他去高海拔地区时根本没什么影响，他的红细胞压积本来就超高了。

I mean, because he goes to altitude and it really wasn't an impact for him because his hematocrit was already so high.

他去当救生员待上五六个星期，真能带来多大的提升呢？

I mean, what percentage gains the guy really didn't get from having a spin at lifeguard for five, you know, six, seven weeks?

这些训练强度可真不是闹着玩的。

So and, I mean, these are intense sessions.

他每次在力量房里一练就是九十分钟，深蹲、抓举、挺举，还有大重量卧推，全都不落下——毕竟说到激素反应，关键就在于调动大量肌群。

Like, I'm going in, like, he's ripping ninety minutes in the ready weight room, and he's doing, like you said, like, you know, deep squats, clean, you know, all those types of Olympic lifts, you know, big time bench press because, you know, when we're talking about hormonal response, we're talking about massive tissue recruitment.

所以有时候，人们在这点上其实有点脱节，比如说……

So I think sometimes there's a little disconnect between, okay.

职业选手确实能吸引女生，但那其实更多是靠局部发力，而不是真正的深蹲。

Well, pros get girls, but that's actually just more of a regional lift versus a nice deep squat.

在我看来，健身房里最能全面调动肌肉群的运动，就是深蹲，它能最大程度地刺激激素分泌。

That's the best, in my book, activity you can do in the gym from a global mass tissue engagement, is then going to stimulate a lot of hormonal engagement.

这有助于释放睾酮和部分生长激素，从而推动运动员的恢复过程。

Going to help release testosterone and some HGH that's going to help catalyze or be the catalyst for this kind of recovery process that's going to happen with an athlete.

但你得动脑子，别瞎练。

Now you have to be intelligent.

我们可不是坐在那儿做二十次一组的深蹲。

We're not sitting here and trying to do two sets of 20 reps on deep squats.

我们用的是中等重量，大概是你单次最大负重的80%，每组做六到八次，一场训练里做一到三组就够了。

I mean, we're still we're looking at something where it's moderate weight, about 80% of I like to say one max rep capacity and, you know, doing anywhere between six to eight reps, one to three times in a session.

这算是比较标准的训练方式了。

I mean, that's that's kinda standard par for the course.

这样能让你在最后几次时突破舒适区，但又不至于练到力竭，否则会过度刺激中枢神经系统——那重量一掉地上，你接下来半分钟都走不动路，身体根本吃不消。

It's gonna allow you to get outside your comfort zone, you know, with the last couple lifts, but not go to complete failure where then you're kinda overtaxing and intoxifying the central nervous system because that weight's just dropping to the floor and you can't walk for the next thirty seconds because your body has something.

让身体涌出这么多激素，其实就是为了提醒自己：别在这儿撑不住了。

Just send all this flood of hormones just to say, Hey, let's not pass out here.

所以，训练方案真的特别关键。我觉得大家在想这些基础动作时，往往忽略了它们的价值，因为它们一点都不花哨。

So again, the prescription is very, very important, and I think when you think about these kind of basic standard lifts, because it's not anything sexy.

我们不是坐在瑞士球上，一只手去碰脚趾，另一只手还举着个50磅的杠铃，那种花架子动作。

We're not you know, you're not trying to sit here on a Swiss ball and touch your toe to your nose with one hand while the other, you know, hands holding a 50 pound barbell straight up in the air type deal.

就是最基础的东西。

It's, you know, the basics.

卧推、深蹲、弓步走、弓步上台阶。

The bench, the deep squat, the lunge walk, the lunge step up.

想想看，怎么才能最大程度激活肌肉，让训练效果直接转移到跑步或者其他运动中，保持我常说的中等偏上的强度水平。

Just think how do you recruit the most muscle tissue that you're trying to engage from a primary functionality direct transfer standpoint to running into a weight session and making sure that you're keeping things kinda what I call that upper moderate type capacity.

训练完之后，身体能维持的极限大概在三分之二到六分之五之间，别超过这个范围。

So more of a, you know, two thirds to, you know, five eights, six eights type maximum avail availability after a hard training session.

再说了，教练们还得明白一点：这些动作本身并不是目的。

Again, you know, when you look at it too, kind of the other thing, you know, coaches you wanna think about is it's not the primary activity.

在力量房里变强，并不直接转化为跑道上的表现。

It's not the you know, getting better in the weight room doesn't have a direct transfer, getting better on track.

你还是得跑，还得跑得快。

You still have to run, you have to run fast.

但力量训练是辅助性的，如果安排得当，能起到关键的增效作用。

But it's a secondary activity that has critical secondary enhancement properties to it if you sequence it right.

记住这一点。

So remember that.

很多教练总说，你得保持充沛状态，必须100%恢复好，才能最大化表现，不然肌糖原不足，举不动重量。

I mean, a lot of times, some coaches are like, well, you gotta live fresh, and you gotta be a 100% fresh, and you gotta maximize this because otherwise, you know, the glycogen, you know, content of muscles is way off and then you can't lift as much.

但在我看来，我希望运动员在长跑或高强度田径训练后，处于轻微糖原耗尽的状态，因为这样能逼着身体激活新的肌纤维，建立新的神经肌肉模式，长远来看反而提升整体运动能力。

It's like, no, we you know, from my perspective, I want my athletes to be a little, you know, in a state of glycogen depletion after doing a long run or a good long, you know, work workout session on the track because, again, we're forcing them to buy new muscle fibers and engage new motor patterns that's gonna help enhance the overall athlete down the road.

这其实是个取舍问题，你得清楚自己在做什么权衡，以及在当前训练周期里，什么对运动员的发展才是最重要的。

So it's, you know, it's about the trade offs, and you have to know the trade offs you're making and what's primary to the development of the athletes you're, you know, working with in the training cycle you're in.

别以为事情能像切片面包一样完美，人人都满意。

So, you know, just again, it's not just a clean slice of bread and everyone's happy.

关键是要知道什么时候、在哪里去实施这些方法。

It's about, you know, knowing when and where to implement these things.

我觉得在长跑和耐力训练圈子里，我们这方面的教育还很欠缺，因为过去根本没人好好讨论过这个问题。

I think that's where we we don't in the distance running endurance community have the proper education because it just hasn't been something that's been talked about enough.

所以我建议大家，去跟你的短跑教练、投掷教练聊聊。

And so I encourage people, like, you know, go talk to your sprints coach, your throws coach.

去跟你的力量与体能教练聊聊。

Go talk to your strength conditioning coach.

去跟你的足球教练聊聊。

Go talk to your soccer coach.

去跟这些不同项目的教练交流一下，因为他们对这些方法更熟悉，这本来就是他们训练体系的一部分。

Go talk, you know, to these coaches and these other, modalities of athletics because they have a little bit more familiarity with it because it's part and parcel for their coaching.

幸运的是，过去十年里，长跑圈子里相关的研究、实践和曝光度都在增加，这件事真的非常重要。

So, you know, and we're luckily getting enough literature, getting enough crafts, getting enough exposure in the distance community in the last ten years, this is something that's really, really hyper important.

确实如此。

Yeah, definitely.

不，你说得很有道理。

No, I mean, you made some great points there.

我的想法是尽量保持简单，重点放在全身性的复合动作上，尽可能调动更多的肌肉群。

Think my takeaways on stuff is I like to keep things simple and my take is big full body movements to recruit as much muscle mass as I want.

我们在力量训练中想达成的目标，其实是激素和神经系统的双重作用。

If you look at what we're trying to accomplish in the weight room, it's a combination of hormonal plus neural.

我们关注激素，是为了让身体做好准备，促进恢复和适应，尤其是在完成短跑训练或高强度训练之后，往往可以通过力量训练帮助身体更好地适应跑步带来的压力。

We look at the hormones to prime the system to maybe give us a little bump in terms of recovery adaptation, especially if we're looking at post track workout or post hard workout, is a lot of times we can use the weight sessions to put our body in a place to adapt to the track session.

通过做一些能调动大肌群的练习，刺激睾酮或生长激素等物质分泌，就能更快地启动这个适应过程。

So by getting a nice hit of testosterone or HGH or whatever it is, from doing some of these larger muscle mass recruited exercises, we can get that process going quicker.

另外，就像你提到的，在身体有点疲劳的状态下训练，其实能逼出平时很难激活的肌肉参与。

The other thing that I look at is, like you said, is that when you train in slightly fatigued state, we can do what I'd call as forcing muscle recruitment when we normally don't get muscle recruitment.

在发展冲刺能力或应对疲劳时，关键在于疲劳会让人脑难以向肌肉发出足够的信号，让它们充分发力。

So one of the biggest things that you look at for developing a kick or looking at fatigue is when fatigue happens, it's basically an inability of your brain to convince your muscles to recruit more muscle and to fire.

如果我们先在跑步或路训后带着疲劳状态进入力量训练，再做些神经负荷高的动作，就能开始培养一种模式：即使糖原不足、疲劳物质堆积，也得让这些神经通路动起来，逼着大腿前侧、后侧这些肌肉全都参与发力。

So if we can come in in a pre fatigue state from the track or from out on the roads and then do something with a high neural demand, then we're already starting to ingrain that pattern of hey, we know we're low on glycogen, we know we've got some fatigue byproducts in there, but we still have to get these pathways moving so that hey, we need all those quads and hamstrings, whatever it is, to fire.

让我们也激活那些可能没足够力气完成全部工作的快肌纤维。

And let's recruit those fast twitch muscle fibers that might not be able to do all the work.

但如果我们在疲劳状态下训练这种肌肉激活模式，就能希望把这种效果带到跑道上。

But if we can train that recruitment pattern in a fatigue state, then hopefully the idea is you translate that out out onto the track.

对，就是这样。

Right, exactly.

这种训练方式，既要在基础力量和准备阶段多做，也要在比赛初期阶段加强。

And this is something where it's like you want to hit this more in your general strength, proper preparation phase as well as also kind of your early comp phase.

尤其是在比赛进入关键阶段，比如高强度赛事或冠军赛的时候，这种训练就显得特别重要。

You know, when you're when you're trying to, you know, click it on all cylinders here in, like, the heartier competitions phase as well as championship phase of racing, you know, that takes the precedent.

那时候，你得感觉状态很好。

And so that's where you wanna feel good.

要感觉反应敏捷。

You wanna feel crisp.

要感觉动作干净利落。

You wanna feel clean.

你希望感觉流畅有力。

You wanna feel chop.

别让动作变得断断续续、沉重迟缓，别塞太多东西进去。

You don't wanna feel, like, choppy and bogged down and heavy legged by trying to tack too much in there.

这事儿你得在训练积累阶段就留意，不管你怎么定义这个阶段。

So this is something that you wanna see about in your build up phase, however you wanna define that.

比赛时你只需要维持这些动作节奏。

And then all you're doing when you're competing is you're just maintaining these flips.

也就是说，在状态更佳的时候，保持这些神经通路的活跃。

I mean, you're just maintaining these neural pathways when a little fresher.

你去比赛时，就像做几次快速冲刺或150米跑，毕竟比赛之间隔了一周，但你不能完全停掉这些训练。

So you're going in and it's just kind of like doing your good fast drives or your one fifty's because you got a week between races, but you you don't wanna completely just stop doing it at all.

这就像说，现在是冠军赛阶段了，所以我们只在比赛日跑，其他六天全休息。

It's like saying, well, we're in our championship phase, and so we're not gonna run any day except our race day, and then we're gonna take six days off.

那样做只会让你迅速退步，一点好处都没有。

You're get a quick detaining effect that's not gonna help at all.

所以在把这些融入训练时，也要留意这一点。

So be cognizant of that as well when you're trying to integrate these things into your training.

哪怕只是每周做两到三次，每次四到五组简单的练习，也能维持训练效果长达六周，只要你保持高强度的快速跑训练，尤其是在比赛之间。

Even something as simple as just one times, four to five reps of activity twice, three times a week is going you know, stop that training effect and have a maintenance maintenance effect for up to, six weeks as long as you're, you know, being at high stimulus or high intensity stimulus of good fast work in between races and races itself.

没错。

Exactly.

要特别清楚自己在什么时候、什么地方、怎么进行这些训练。

Be, you know, be hyperconscious of when, where, and how you're doing it.

但如果你真能把这个做进去，我觉得这在未来几年会彻底改变高中乃至大学长跑教练的方式，帮助所有人跑得更快——毕竟，我们当教练、在跑道上盯着配速、让运动员一圈圈地跑，不就是为了这个吗？

But if you do integrate this thing, I really see this as the game changer for a lot of especially high school distance type coaching here in the next couple of years and even the college level to help, you know, enhance everyone getting one faster because I think that's, you know, why we're on coaching and why we, you know, are at the track reading splits for reps and why athletes are running around in circles.

运动员周末跑长距离、做这么多额外训练，其实根本目的就是想跑得更快。

You know, they they have no more energy and why they're out there on the weekends doing long runs and all the extra things is, you know, the end game is always to get faster.

所以这是我特别推荐你们去关注的另一个关键点，无论你是教练还是自己训练，都能帮你们和运动员跑得更快。

So this is another key thing that I really encourage you to look into to help the athletes you're working with or even yourself if you're self coach get faster.

没错。

Exactly.

我的意思是，这太关键了。

I mean, that that's huge.

训练顺序真的很重要。

Think Sequencing is is important.

我觉得在打基础阶段，或者说不管你怎么称呼它，我们其实是在关注两个极端。

I almost see it as as when you're building your base or whatever you wanna call it, we look at it as the extremes.

对吧？

Right?

我们既要练耐力，练长时间的有氧能力，但同时，基础阶段的另一部分，是那种纯粹的速度和力量根基，也得打牢。

We want that general endurance, that longer aerobic stuff, but at the same time, the other component of that base is that pure speed, pure strength foundation that we need to build.

而这正是这套训练要做的——只要我们在基础期、准备期，或者赛前阶段，能狠狠地练到位。

And that's what this stuff does, and that's if we can hit it hard during that base or general prep or pre competition, whatever you want to call it.

之后就转成维持状态就行了。

And then just simply go into maintenance phase.

举个例子，我们现在对运动员的做法是，比如周一，我们进来就做了一组深蹲和抓举，还有几个其他动作，最后用一些轻松的爆发力练习收尾，像箱跳之类的，把力量转化成更实用的动作，就这么完了。

You know what, what a lot of times we do for instance, what we're doing with our athletes right now is, I'll give you Mondays, but Mondays we came in and just did one set of, I think it was squats and cleans, and then a couple other exercises, but then ended with some easy power things where we did some box jumps to get to almost translate that power into something a little more functional and that was it.

所以这只是一个维持阶段，每组做五到六次，强度还算适中，但能保持神经通路的活跃。

So it's just a maintenance phase where it's like one set of five or six reps, it's still somewhat moderate, but keeps that pathway going.

等室内赛季结束后，我们再重新加大训练量。

And then we'll pick it back up after indoors.

我们会再进入另一个基础准备阶段，临近户外赛季前再高强度练一阵，然后转为维持加一点力量转化的阶段。

We'll go back into another general prep phase where we hit it hard a little bit before going into outdoors and then back into kind of a a maintenance plus translated into a little bit of power phase.

是的。

Yeah.

没错。

Exactly.

不是。

No.

说得太准了，史蒂夫。

That's that's spot on, Steve.

我们这儿也完全在做同样的事情。

I've we're we're totally doing the same type of stuff here.

还有一件事我想快速提一下，就是保持动作速度的完整性。

You know, the other thing I wanna speak to real quick too is just, you know, maintaining integrity of the velocity of the movements.

比如你做多级跳、跳箱、药球训练或者力量举时，要确保自己处在大约80%单次最大重量的黄金区间，而且杠铃、动作、跳跃或药球的速度在整个组里都要保持住。

So, you know, if you're doing like a multi jumps or box jumps or if you're doing med ball work or if you're doing some lifts, like, you wanna make sure that you're working in that sweet spot of 80% type one rep max capacity, but that the bar speeds or the movement speeds or the jump or the ball, what have you, is being maintained throughout the exercise.

所以你要把它当成和短跑冲刺一样，属于高强度神经激活的训练——得保证组间有足够的休息，别让动作变慢了，否则练出来的就是我常说的‘无效训练’，纯粹为了做动作而做动作。

So you want to treat it cause it has this high neural component just like sprinting true true absolute max loss of sprinting does where you're making sure there's enough rest in between sets of reps and things that you're doing so that you'd not keep training these slow movement or you're training these slower movement patterns that are actually what, you know, what I call junk lifting or, you know, junk movements because like, oh, yeah.

比如硬往杠铃上加一堆片，硬撑着做五组卧推，就为了拍个好看的照片发社交媒体。

Well, we're just gonna put many plates on the barbell as possible and try to bench press, you know, five five times with all these plates on and look good, you know, for Instagram shot or what have you.

但到第三下时，杠铃早就慢得像蜗牛爬了。

But, you know, after the third rep, I mean, that bar is moving real slow.

这种练法根本达不到我们教练和运动员训练计划里想要的那种效果。

Nothing's really going on from a beneficial standpoint that we want from, you know, kind of a coach athlete structure training plan.

所以一旦发现运动员动作变慢了，你就得及时调整，比如跟他说：

So that's when you need to if you see that with the athlete, you know, you have this intention of saying, hey.

我们本来计划做两组，每组五次，但如果他每组最后几次都特别吃力，那今天这重量可能就太重了。

We're gonna do two times five sets, but, you know, the athlete's struggle in there on the last couple reps of each set or something, you know, the the weight might be too heavy that day.

即使他们说，‘教练，有个事儿想跟你说。’

Even if they say, oh, hey, coach.

前两天或者三天前，我们刚来健身房的时候。

Well, two days ago or three days ago, we're the gym last.

那时候我用同样的重量，速度可快多了，感觉特别好。

I was fetching the same, you know, weight at the same at a much faster speed, I felt great.

那为什么现在要降重量呢？

So why would I wanna, you know, go back down?

关键还是要找到那个最佳速度区间。

And, again, it's finding that sweet spot, that bar speed.

动作速度从不会骗人，我一向这么说。

So the bar speed never lies as I always or and so and so that's the thing.

你得清楚自己现在训练状态怎么样，可能前两天运动员状态爆棚，用同样的重量轻松完成。

I mean, you gotta be aware of what your kinda, you know, current level of fitness is in the weight room, but you might have done, you know, those previous, previous day when there the athlete was hitting on all cylinders and moving that same weight just fine and dandy.

那天可能只举了120公斤，神经负荷很低，训练量也不大，他们感觉特别棒。

It might have been, like, ten two hundreds and a really light neural workout in a vault from a volume standpoint, and they're feeling great.

然后你可能会安排五组一英里的间歇跑，按他们目标三千米的速度跑，因为训练量大、强度高，他们会觉得有点吃力、疲劳。

Then, you might have a mile repeats like five mile repeats at their goal three ks pace and they're a little attacked and a little fatigued because high volume, high intensity day.

所以适当减点重量，只要保持杠铃速度的稳定性，依然能获得很好的训练效果。

So back off a little bit because you still can get value out of that by lifting a little bit less weight as long as the bar speed integrity is maintained.

没错，就是这样。

Yeah, exactly.

这个观点特别到位。

That's a really good point.

从教练的角度来看，观察杠铃速度是判断疲劳程度、是否达到预期训练适应和刺激效果的绝佳指标。

Just looking at bar speed, again, from a coaching standpoint, is a great cue of how the fatigue is manifesting itself and whether you're getting the adaptations and the stress of the workout that you want.

另一个稍微相关的话题，之前我们提到过一点，就是所谓的动作模仿——我觉得这在耐力跑乃至所有运动领域都是个普遍误解。现在流行搞些花哨的东西，比如用波速球或者平衡训练器材，当然我不是说稳定性不重要。

Another topic kind of segueing a little bit that you touched on or we touched on a little bit earlier is what I'd call this mimicry of movement, which I think is a big misconception in the world of not only distance running, but all sports really is that there's been this trend to try and get a little bit fancy and use whether it's Bosu balls or stability stuff, which don't get me wrong, you need some stability.

但问题是，有人想用这些工具，硬说要在力量训练里模仿跑步动作。

But to use those kinds of things and almost try and do this, hey, we're going to mimic running in the weight room.

于是就有人单腿做深蹲、平衡训练，试图模仿跑步时的动作之类。

So you get people doing lifts on one legged balance, trying to mimic some sort of running motion and things like that.

你要是觉得我说得不对，尽管纠正我，但我一直觉得这种做法完全跑偏了。

And you can correct me if I'm wrong, but I've always felt that that that misses the boat.

对吧？

Right?

你去健身房根本不是为了模仿户外运动的动作。

Because you're not trying to go into the weight room to mimic what the movement is outside.

因为跑步时的动作是高度动态的，涉及大量反射和神经系统的参与，对吧？

Because the movement is very dynamic movement that occurs, with a lot of stress reflexes, a lot of neural components, right?

重点不在这儿。

That's not the point.

没错。

Right.

你跑步的时候，哪次单脚着地能持续五秒？

I mean, when when are you when running, do you have single leg contact for five seconds Exactly.

还负重五十磅以上？

Under a 50 plus pound load?

还是说，你单脚着地十到三十秒，踩在特别不平、不稳定的地面上，还负着重物？

Or do you have, know, the single leg contact for ten thirty seconds on a very uneven, unbalanced surface, you know, with a heavy load?

这根本没法直接对应到实际运动中。

Like, it it doesn't it doesn't translate.

我尊重你的创意，也理解你这种想法的来源。

I respect the creativity, and I respect the, you know, place the thought pattern came from it.

我觉得这类训练，适合在休赛期做做，纯粹为了好玩，练练神经肌肉的协调性，有点转移效果，但主要就是换个花样，打破单调。

It's It's kind of something you can do, I think, really in your off season type deal, like, alright, this is just some fun stuff from a neuromuscular kind of coordination component that, you know, has a little bit of transfer, but it's just fun to break up the monotony of things.

我一向主张直接的迁移效果，必须是直接的迁移效果。

I'm always a big fan of trying to think direct transfer effect, direct transfer effect.

这样能帮你理清重点——运动员的时间有限，能高质量、有强度地完成的动作本来就不多。

That can kind of really clear your plate in terms of, you know, you only have so much time that an athlete can perform exercises, you know, with good intensity and good integrity.

那就选那些直接迁移效果最强的动作，别浪费时间在这些间接迁移的花哨小把戏上。

So do the ones that have a direct transfer effect or the biggest direct transfer versus all these kind of indirect transfer, you know, cutie woodsy drills.

这些动作确实挺有趣的。

You know, they're fun.

这些动作拍下来发到YouTube上，确实能唬住朋友，但说实话，你也就只能得到这点好处了。

They're they're they're cool to throw on YouTube and impress your friends with, but, I mean, that's about all really I think you're gonna get out of it.

你把所有时间都花在这上面，却根本得不到你想要的训练效果。

And you spend all your time doing this stuff, and it's just not gonna have the transfer you want.

这就像说，我们是长跑运动员，所以每天就去跑道上反复练。

It's the same idea concept of saying, Well, we're a distance runner, so we're gonna go and we're gonna just hit reps every day at the track.

有一天练快速短冲，第二天练长距离节奏跑，再下一天练最大摄氧量训练。

Some reps will be fast and short one day, then the following day, we'll do long tempo reps, and then the following day, we'll do v o two reps.

你花大量时间和精力去搞这些训练，想全塞进训练计划里，但顺序和时机不对，根本达不到你期望的长期效果——真正该做的，是用有限的时间，把运动员的潜力发挥到极致，贯穿整个赛季或多年训练。

And, you know, you're gonna spend all this time and energy doing all this stuff that you wanna incorporate in your training, but the sequencing of it and the timing of it is just not gonna give you the lasting impact that you want, which is basically doing the best asset you can with the time you have tutoring that athlete for that season or those series of years.

这始终才是最终目标。

And that's always the end game.

对吧？

Right?

是的。

Yeah.

没错。

Exactly.

不，我觉得你这话说得特别到位，那种模仿行为我也认同。

No, I think that sums it up pretty nicely because you see that kind of mimicry, which again, I'm with you.

我喜欢这种创意，但你得记住你训练的真正目标是什么。

I like the creativity, but you got to remember what you're training for.

说到这个，我经常被高中教练问到：我们时间这么紧，该怎么把这东西塞进去？

On that note, one of the things that I always get asked from high school coaches, they're like, Well, we only got so much time in here, how do we stick this in?

你是不是一开始就从力量训练入手，比如短跑？

Is that the first thing you start out with in terms of, I consider it strength training, is sprinting, right?

这可是直接能转化的训练。

It's a direct transfer.

它调动的肌肉群远比其他任何重复动作或训练都要多。

It recruits a ton more muscle mass than you would doing any other reps or any other workout.

我们说的纯粹是冲刺，就该从这个开始。

And we're talking pure speed sprinting here, is start with that.

等运动员能跑起来之后，就可以进入下一步，带他们进健身房，做我们一开始那些训练了。

Once your athletes can sprint, great, then you can move on to the next step and start getting them in the weight room and start doing some of the things we started with.

但如果你之前从来没做过速度或力量训练，也不意味着一上来就得全盘搬进健身房，马上做这些动作。

But it doesn't mean you have to, if you've never done any sort of speed or strength work before, it doesn't mean you have to go wholesale straight into the weight room, straight into doing some of these things.

不如先从户外开始。

It's like, well start outside.

让队员们去平地或者坡道上冲刺，不管哪种方式，先激活神经和肌纤维的反应。

Go get your guys to sprint, either on the flat ground or up a hill or whatever it is, and start getting those neural components and those muscle fiber components engaged.

是的，这又回到了我们几期节目前聊过的那些基础又安全的原则。

Yeah, start taking it goes back to clean safe phenomena that we talked about a couple of podcasts ago.

先在平地上跑，再上坡跑，坡道本身就是阻力，直接提升运动效果，性价比很高。

You know, sprint on a flat, then sprint up a hill because that's resistance in and of itself, the direct transfer effect, and you have a lot of bang for your buck.

但如果这些方法你已经用得差不多了，某个运动员的训练计划里早就包含这些内容，这时候就需要换个新起点，才该进健身房。

But if you've already exhausted those things, if those are already been a part of your training plan for a certain athlete and you need a new clean slate, that's when it's time to get into the weight room.

没错。

Exactly.

要知道，还是那句话，力量训练只能排在后面，永远是次要的。

Know, again, it's secondary, secondary, secondary.

这点我再怎么强调都不为过。

I cannot preach that.

而且这种训练的附加收益很高，但它始终是辅助训练，比不上短跑这类训练带来的直接效果提升。

And that fits has a high benefit of a secondary component, but it is secondary training to the actual direct transfer effect of running tripping.

没错。

Exactly.

其实很多人都会忽略这一点，现在不管是听各种教练还是行业分享者聊天，他们出发点都很好，但总把这个关键点给漏掉了

You know, that's also something that kinda get lost that gets lost in the shuffle as well for a loss in the the sounding matches that you hear with all these well intentioned coaches or well intentioned, you know, speakers just being like, hey.

就觉得必须得做力量训练才行

You gotta do this stuff.

这点非常重要，我完全同意。

It's really important, which I agree.

但如果你的跑量跟不上，每周或日常的训练量都不达标，也没安排恢复性的慢跑训练，那身体连基础的有氧能力都练不出来，前面说的那些训练方法就根本无从谈起了。

But if you're not getting enough running in, if you're not getting enough weekly, or daily volume in, if you're not doing recovery regeneration runs, it's that's the you get an oxidative effect, got the glues, that holds your training gear, all this is a moot moot point here.

你知道，这可能是我们该收尾的地方了，我也想回应一下刚才的说法。

You know, that's that's this is probably good point to end it on and just to reciprocate that a little bit.

我现在负责我们队的所有力量训练，但以前我们请过专门的举重教练，那时候我们总在这事上争个不停，因为他觉得进健身房才是最重要的。

I do all our strength stuff for our team now, but we originally had a weight coach and we'd always go back and forth on this because in his mind going into the weight room was the most important thing.

也许不是最重要，但确实非常关键。

Maybe not the most, but highly important.

我当然也看到它的价值，但我一直说，这属于次要的。

While I obviously see a lot of value in I always said, This is secondary.

它很重要，但如果我们在健身房花的时间太多，严重影响了户外训练，那我们就失衡了。

It's of a lot of importance, but if what we do in here starts to take away significantly from what we are doing out there, then we have messed up the balance.

刚开始适应的时候，身体会酸痛，所以我们通常安排在基础阶段；但一旦适应了，如果力量训练变得太猛，开始影响我们完成必要的训练量或下一堂课的状态，那就得减量了——因为我们得记住，最重要、最专项、转移效果最好的，始终是我们在跑道、公路上、越野赛道上做的那些训练，对吧？

Once we're adapted, obviously, at first you're a little sore, that's why you do it in the base phase, but once we're adapted, if this weight stuff is becoming so intense that it's starting to affect our ability to get in the volume we need or the next workout we need, then it's time to scale back because we have to remember that the most important thing, the most specific thing, the biggest transfer we get is what we're doing out on the track, on the road, on the cross country course, right?

是的，没错。

Mhmm, oh yeah.

好的。

Cool.

希望刚才这些内容能引发一些讨论，也让大家好好想想。

Well hopefully this gave a little bit of controversy and a little bit of things to chew on.

我本人觉得特别有意思，也收获了不少新的见解。

I certainly enjoyed it and got some good insight out of it.

再次感谢你，约翰，这是我们的第三期播客了。

So thanks again, John, for podcast number three.

当然，老兄。

Yes, dude.

每次都特别开心。

Always fun.

咱们继续做下去吧。

Let's keep doing it.

好的。

Alright.

谢谢。

Thanks.

我们下周再聊。

We'll talk to you next week.

好。

Alright.