SiC：碳化硅模块封装，嘉宾为Ainhoa Puyadena-Mier

大家好。

Hi, folks.

我是法比安，你正在收听的是面向工程师的播客，如果你对半导体市场的动态感兴趣，这个播客是你绝对不能错过的。

This is Fabian, and you are listening to the podcast for engineers, the podcast you just have to listen to if you're interested in what's going on in the semiconductor market.

今天的节目将讨论碳化硅。

Today episode will deal about SiC.

关于这个宽禁带话题，我们已经做了几期节目。

There is a couple of episodes on this wide band gap topic.

而今天，我们将讨论碳化硅模块封装及其应用。

And today, we will be talking about SiC silicon carbide module packages and applications.

像往常一样，我很高兴请到了一位专家，她的名字是艾诺阿·普亚德纳。

As always, I'm very happy to have an expert with me, and her name is Ainhoa Puyadena.

艾诺阿，你不自我介绍一下吗？

Ainhoa, why don't you introduce yourself?

好的，嗨，法比安，非常感谢你邀请我。

Yeah, hi Fabian, thanks so much for having me.

很高兴来到这里。

It is a pleasure to be here.

是的，正如你所说，我是Ainhoa Puyadena，是英飞凌的碳化硅模块产品定义和应用工程师。

So yeah, as you said, I'm Ainhoa Puyadena and I'm a product definition and application engineer for silicon carbide modules at Infineon.

好的，谢谢你的介绍。

Well, thanks for the introduction.

显然，大家都在谈论宽禁带材料，大家都在谈论碳化硅。

Obviously, everybody's talking about wide bandgap materials, everybody's talking about silicon carbide.

今天我们想重点讨论模块。

Today we would like to focus on modules.

它们是一直伴随着我们吗？

Have they always been around with us?

它们是一直在被使用吗？

Have they been always in use?

你能给我们讲讲碳化硅模块的发展历史吗？

Can you tell us about history of the development of modules in SiC?

是的，正如你提到的，碳化硅器件在过去几年里经历了一波大发展，但实际上这一切始于90年代，最初主要是朝着碳化硅二极管的方向发展。

Yeah, so as you mentioned, silicon carbide devices experienced quite a boom over the past few years, but actually it all began rather in the 90s with first developments mostly in the direction of silicon carbide diodes.

所以，对我来说，我甚至可以说我们都是90后。

So yeah, in my case, I can even say that we are both 90s kids.

我提到了碳化硅二极管，而且在功率模块中，第一款采用碳化硅器件的产品是混合型的。

I mentioned silicon carbide diodes and also in power modules, the first released product with SiC device was a hybrid one.

这意味着将IGBT技术与碳化硅二极管结合起来。

This means combining IGBT technology with Silicon carbide diodes.

为什么？

Why?

主要是因为这样我们能够减少IGBT的内部损耗。

Essentially because this way we were able to reduce the IGBT internal losses.

这也是为什么这种组合至今仍然很流行，比如在太阳能组串逆变器中。

And that is why actually this is still a combination which is quite popular today, for instance, in solar power string inverters.

好，我们继续回到简短的历史课。

Yeah, continuing back to the compact history lesson.

所以，我们是从碳化硅二极管模块开始的，而直到几年前，我们才首次将Cool SiC MOSFET模块推向市场。

So, we started with silicon carbide diode modules and it is just only a few years ago when we first introduced cool SiC MOSFET module into the market.

对，我们最初推出的是1200伏的产品，现在还在不断扩展电压等级的产品线。

Yeah, so we started with a 1,200 volt device and now we are even extending the offering in voltage classes as well.

总的来说，正如你所说，从那以后它的受欢迎程度一直在增长。

So, all in all, as you mentioned, popularity has only grown ever since.

完全理解。

Perfectly understood.

那有没有什么原因，比如不同的封装，像EASI XHP？

Is there a reason why there's, well, different packages, for example, EASI XHP?

它们分别针对什么需求？

What do they address?

是特定应用场景，还是它们是怎么发展出来的？

Is this specific applications or how did they come into being?

是的，碳化硅技术总体上正成为可再生能源发电和电动汽车的关键推动力。

Yeah, so Silicon carbide technology in general becomes a key enabler for renewable energy generation, for e mobility.

具体来说，就是太阳能储能系统、电动汽车、公交车、卡车，甚至火车。

In detail, are talking about solar energy storage systems, electric cars, buses, trucks or even trains.

当然，这也和电动汽车充电站密切相关。

And for sure, with this goes hand in hand EV charging stations.

正因为如此，由于我们面向不同的应用和功率等级，我们也需要提供广泛的产品组合。

And because of that, since we are targeting different applications and also power ratings, we also need an extensive portfolio offering.

这意味着还需要不同的封装概念和尺寸，以满足客户的需求。

This means also different package concepts and sizes that fits to customer requirements.

所以，正如你提到的，从easy产品系列开始，它提供了最高的灵活性和可扩展性，一直到62毫米甚至XHP高功率模块，这些模块带有螺钉端子和基板。

So, as you mentioned, starting with easy product family that offers highest flexibility and scalability to also 62 millimeter or even XHP high power modules that have screw terminals and baseplate.

例如，仅easy系列，我们就有超过50款产品。

And for example, in easy family only, we already have over 50 products on our portfolio.

所以我把它们一个一个都数了一遍。

So I have them count them all one by one.

那真是不少

That's quite a

不过，是的，这样你就能看到我们在过去几年里发布了多少产品。

But yeah, so just you can see how many products we have released in the last few years.

对，尤其是easy系列正在成为碳化硅技术的标准载体，无论是混合型还是全碳化硅产品。

Yeah, so especially easy is becoming the standard, so to say, host for Silicon carbide technology, let it be hybrid or full SiC product.

好的，非常感谢。

Okay, thank you so much.

那模块的特点怎么样？

And how about the features of modules?

显然有分立器件和模块两种。

Obviously there's discretes and there's modules.

那么相比分立器件，模块到底有什么特别之处呢？

So compared to discretes, what does a module make a module?

对，基本上如果聚焦在easy模块上。

Yeah, so basically if I focus on easy modules.

嗯，easy模块在电力电子领域已经相当成熟了，但先从一些基本事实说起也无妨。

Well, easy modules are quite established in the power electronics world, but it doesn't hurt to start with maybe some basic facts.

所以，easy系列一共有四个成员。

So easy family consists of four members.

它们的尺寸各不相同。

So we have different sizes.

有比较小的型号。

We have the little brothers.

就是EC1B和EC2B。

These are EC1B and EC2B.

不过，其实它们是最早推出的。

Although, yeah, actually they are the oldest.

说它们是“小兄弟”可能不太合适，因为它们在市场上时间最长。

So little brothers who are actually the longest on the market, so probably isn't the best wordplay.

总之，接下来是EC3B，以及新推出的EC4B。

But anyway, and then we have the EC3B and newly introduced EC4B.

这些封装更大，但设计理念是一样的。

These packages are larger, but the concept itself stays the same.

最重要的是，所有家族成员都保持了相同的高度和安装概念。

Most importantly, the height and mounting concept is maintained across all family members.

这一点很关键，因为如果客户想在同一个PCB或同一条生产线上组合使用，比如EC1B和EC4B，就非常方便。

This is essential in case we want to combine, for example, an EC1B with an EC4B in the same PCB or in the same production line at the customer side.

Easy产品其实非常即插即用，因为你可以直接把它们安装在PCB上。

Easy products, actually quite plug and play, because you can directly just mount them on the PCB.

它们没有基板，这在重量和体积受限的情况下很有优势，而且在电源和控制引脚的位置和数量上提供了完全的灵活性。

They do not have a baseplate, which is beneficial when it comes to weight and volume restrictions, and they offer full flexibility with regards to the position and amount of power and control pins.

再说一次，通过TC模块，我们能够提供非常广泛且紧凑的解决方案。

Again, so with TC modules, we are able to offer very broad and compact solutions.

这正是客户喜欢的地方。

And this is what our customers like.

所以不仅仅是功率等级，我们还能覆盖各种拓扑结构。

So it's not just about power ratings, but also topologies we are able to address.

我们有半桥、H桥、六管封装、升压模块、三电平模块，比如MPC1、MPC2、MPC整流模块，你应该明白我的意思了。

We have half bridges, H bridges, six packs, booster modules, three level modules, like MPC one, MPC two, MPC rectifier modules, you know where I want to get.

所以，基本上你能想到的都能实现。

So, almost anything you can think of is possible.

那基本上就是一个产品里包含了完整的拓扑结构？

So, it's basically complete topology in a single product?

没错。

Exactly.

对，我们一个产品里集成了好几个开关。

So, we've got several switches in one single product.

而且就像之前提到的，我们可以在单个产品里组合不同的技术和不同的电压等级。

And we can, as mentioned before, combine different technologies, different voltage classes within only one single product.

这就是它的紧凑性所在。

And this is the compactness.

我们提供这种一站式解决方案，客户非常认可，因为这大大降低了他们的复杂度。

The fact that we are offering an all inclusive solution is what is very highly appreciated from customer side, because it reduces complexity at their end.

也缩短了上市时间，还简化了制造流程。

Time to market as well and simplifies manufacturing process.

所以，就像之前提到的，你只需要把模块压到PCB上，再装到散热器上，这样就不需要那么多手工操作，也不用一个一个地焊接每个分立器件。

So, as mentioned before, you only need to press a module into a PCB, mount it over a heat sink, so you do not need so much manual work or do not need to solder every single discrete device one by one.

你不需要额外的绝缘膜，因为绝缘实际上是在模块内部完成的。

You don't need any additional isolation foil because the isolation actually happens within the module.

所以，这些都是客户在使用模块时看到的一些好处。

So, those are some of the benefits the customer sees when using modules.

好的，Ainhoa。

Okay, Ainhoa.

我们已经讨论了SiC在模块中的优势。

So, we've talked about the benefits of SiC in modules.

我感觉这背后可能也有一些技术挑战。

I have a feeling that there also might be technical challenges going with that.

是的，所以永远不会无聊，Fabianne。

Yeah, so it never gets boring, Fabianne.

确实总是有一些挑战。

There are always a couple of challenges, yes.

所以，降低客户端的复杂度通常意味着我们这边的复杂度会增加。

So reducing complexity at customer side usually means increasing complexity at our end.

所以在做最优的模块设计时，我们肯定会遇到挑战，但我们总是想办法去解决它们。

So when making a proper optimal module design, for sure we encounter challenges, but we always try to find a way to manage them.

比如，在做新设计时，我们要确保它是低电感的对称设计，电流路径要短，栅极回路的电感要尽可能小。

So, for example, when making a new design, we have to make sure it is a low inductive symmetrical design, that computation paths are kept short, that gate loop inductance is as small as possible.

还有，比如在并联开关时，我们也要确保以最优的方式来做，避免芯片间振荡，并避免内部设计中的不对称。

And for example, when paralleling switches, we also have to make sure it is done in an optimal way without causing any inter chip oscillations and avoiding asymmetries on the internal design.

而且所有这些当然还要保证良好的热性能，考虑爬电距离和电气间隙的标准，最重要的是，始终把高质量和高可靠性放在首位。

And all this for sure is still ensuring that we get a proper thermal performance, that we consider standards also regarding creepage and clearance, and most importantly, top of the list always comes high quality reliability.

对吧？

Right?

所以我知道我们讨论了英飞凌面临的技术挑战。

So I know we talked about the challenges, technical challenges at Infineon.

那设计工程师那边呢？

How about the design engineer?

他之前用过分立器件吗？

Has he worked with discretes?

他会改用模块吗？

Will he change to modules?

或者我们怎么处理这个问题？

Or how do we handle this?

对于任何给定的应用，有没有一个完美的解决方案，或者你会给一个问你这个问题工程师什么建议？

Is there a perfect solution to any given application or what would you suggest to an engineer asking you this question?

对，这确实是个很有意思的问题，对吧？

Yeah, so this is always quite an interesting question, right?

那么设计工程师应该选择分立器件还是模块方案呢？

So should a design engineer go for discrete or for module solution?

这取决于几个因素，就像我们之前提到的。

So it depends on several factors, like we mentioned before.

如果选择模块，可能更适合制造流程。

So, it might be more suitable for manufacturing process if you go for modules.

但另一方面，也许你想用分立器件来实现更灵活的方案。

But on the other hand, so maybe you want to go for more flexible solution with discretes.

所以除了总体要求之外，客户那边的设计工程师的个人经验也常常会起到作用。

So apart from the requirements in general, the personal experience of the design engineers at customer side comes very often into play.

比如，他们之前有没有用过模块，或者有没有用过分立器件？

So, have they already worked with modules or have they already worked with disc grids before?

这通常也会对之后的决定产生很大影响。

This usually also has a big impact the decision afterwards.

但另一个关键因素是目标功率等级。

But one of the other key factors is the targeted power ratings.

如果我们做的是低功率设计，那么用分立器件可能更合理。

So if we are going for low power rating design, then it might make more sense to go for discretes.

功率越高，需要并联的分立器件就越多。

Now, the more you go up on power, the more discretes you would have to parallel.

这时候可能采用模块设计更合适，因为这样客户那边的设计就不会那么复杂。

And then it might make more sense to go for module design, because then they keep the design at the customer side less complex.

一开始你提到了各种应用。

So in the beginning you mentioned various applications.

我想更深入地探讨一下这个话题。

I would like to dwell a little deeper into that.

比如以电动汽车充电为例，谈谈分立器件和模块。

Let's take for example EV charging, talking about discretes and modules.

对于设计工程师，你会给出什么建议呢？

What would you suggest here to a design engineer?

说到电动汽车充电器，车载和非车载充电器中会用到不同类型的碳化硅模块。

So talking about EV chargers, there are different kinds of silicon carbide modules are used in both onboard and off board chargers.

这意味着，对于车载充电器应用，我们提供汽车级产品；对于非车载充电器，我们提供工业级产品。

So this means we offer automotive for onboard charger applications, so automotive products, and industrial products for off board chargers.

如果只关注非车载直流充电器，作为用户，可能是你、我，或者现在正在听我们说话的任何人，我们可以在车库里安装一个壁挂式充电桩。

If we focus purely on off board DC chargers, as a user, it could be me or you or anybody who's listening to us right now, so we can have a wallbox installed in a garage.

这通常由分立器件来覆盖，因为功率等级相对较低。

And this is usually an arena covered by discrets because the power ratings are rather low.

通常用户对充电时间不会太着急，因为车可能在车库里停一整晚。

Usually the user is not so stressed out about the charging time because the car might have a long night's sleep in the garage.

所以在这里，尺寸可能更重要，因为，嗯，我不知道你的车库怎么样，但我的车库挺小的，没人想让充电站占掉半个车库。

So here maybe size could be of higher importance because well, I don't know about yours but my garage is quite small and no one wants to have half of the garage occupied by a charging station.

而且

And

另一方面，尤其是在高速公路上，需要快速直流充电桩。

now in the other side of the coin, so especially in highways, fast DC chargers are needed.

所以，比如从伯恩斯坦开车去慕尼黑的人，可能希望在中间充电时最多等几分钟，顺便去喝杯咖啡。

So, as a person traveling from Bernstein to Munich, you might want to wait maximum a few minutes while charging your car in the middle, while you go grab a coffee.

所以，最多也就这样。

So, that's maximum.

大概几分钟。

We're about a few minutes.

所以在这里，充电时间就非常关键了。

That's why here charging time is essential.

所以，在高速公路上的快速直流充电桩，我们看到功率等级已经提升到了几百千瓦的范围。

And therefore, in the fast DC chargers, we see on the highways power ratings here increased to the 100s kilowatt range.

可能高达300千瓦，甚至350千瓦。

So, maybe up to 300 kilowatt, three fifty.

我不确定未来他们还会给我们带来什么惊喜。

I'm not sure with what they will surprise us in the future.

但趋势肯定是向上的，这将是功率模块的用武之地。

But the trend is definitely going upwards and this would be the field for power modules.

完全理解。

Perfectly understood.

随着可再生能源的兴起，储能系统也变得越来越重要。

With the renewables on the rise, energy storage systems also get more and more important.

对此你有什么想说的吗？

Any things you can say to this?

总的来说，可再生能源。

In general, renewable energies.

所以，我们一方面有发电，另一方面也有储能的挑战。

So, we have from one side the generation, but also the challenge of storage.

举个例子，比如太阳能应用，这里我们看到很多不同设计的模块。

So, if we put an example application of solar, here we see a lot of modules coming in different designs.

我们说的是升压功率级，还有直流交流功率级。

So, we are talking about the booster power stage, but also DCAC power stage.

这里我们也经常看到功率模块，尤其是在直流交流那一级。

So here we very often see power modules as well, especially on the DCAC stage.

比如，我们经常看到三电平拓扑：MPC1、MPC2和MPC，这里适用于1000伏和1500伏系统。

So, for example, we see very often three level topologies: MPC1, MPC2, and MPC, here for both 1,000 volt and 1,500 volt systems.

而且这里功率模块经常是混合型的。

And very often here the power modules hybrid.

也就是说，我们用IGBT搭配碳化硅二极管，或者IGBT搭配碳化硅MOSFET。

This means that we are using IGBT in combination with Silicon carbide diode or IGBT in combination with Silicon carbide MOSFET.

实际上，储能系统的情况也类似。

Similar story actually goes for energy storage system.

这里我们也经常看到使用纯碳化硅或混合设计的功率模块。

Here we see also very often designs with power modules using pure silicon carbide or hybrid designs.

好的，我们也想展望一下未来的发展。

Okay, so what we also like to do is to look into the future of the development.

你可以花几句话讲讲碳化硅封装未来的发展趋势。

A couple of sentences you might want to spend on what the future will look like for packages with silicon carbide.

是的，我敢说碳化硅模块的未来一片光明。

Yeah, I would dare to say that future looks bright for Silicon carbide modules.

我不知道你怎么看，但我对此相当乐观。

I don't know how you feel, but I'm quite optimistic about it.

对，不仅整个市场会变大。

Yeah, not only the cake will get bigger in general.

我的意思是，我们只需看看全球的大趋势，比如电动出行、能源生成、分配和存储，而且碳化硅模块肯定有潜力占据更大的市场份额。

So, I mean, we only have to look at global mega trends like immobility, energy generation, distribution and storage, but also silicon carbide modules certainly have the potential to take a bigger piece of that cake.

凭借我们的沟槽技术和在模块设计制造方面的高质量经验，我们能够向市场推出非常好的产品。

With our trench technology and our experience in module design and manufacturing with high quality, we are able to deliver very good products into the market.

当然，我们必须确保持续创新。

For sure, we have to make sure we continue innovating.

但这是英飞凌的本性，所以我不担心这部分。

But this is Infineon's nature, so I'm not worried about that part.

我们在技术和封装方面都有非常令人兴奋的进展，这肯定会帮助我们成为创新领导者，也就是趋势引领者。

And we have very exciting developments coming up in both technology and package side that will surely help us be innovation leaders and so just a trend maker.

我对未来非常乐观。

I'm quite optimistic about the future.

听起来是不是很棒？

Well, doesn't that sound great?

Ainhoa，非常感谢你在本期节目中分享关于碳化硅模块的见解。

Ainhoa, thank you so much for giving us the insight in this episode about Silicon carbide in modules.

谢谢你，Fabian，这是我的荣幸。

Thanks to you, Fabian, it was a pleasure.

不客气。

More than welcome.

希望大家喜欢这一期节目。

I hope you enjoyed this episode.

请记得继续关注，因为后面还有很多精彩内容，特别是关于碳化硅的。

Please make sure that you stay tuned because there's lots of more to come, especially with regards to Silicon carbide.

感谢收听。

Thanks for listening.