5000位播客听众刚刚告诉我们独立节目增长的真相

如果你正在听这段话，那很可能你是个独立播客主——也就是说，没有大型播客平台帮你推广节目，也没人帮你触达目标听众。

If you're listening to this, there's a pretty good chance that you are an indie podcaster, as in you don't have the full weight of a major podcasting publisher helping you market your show and get it in the right ears of the right audience.

所以，作为这样一个独立播客主，我有个问题想问你。

So I've got a question for you as said indie podcaster.

如果你一直在持续更新内容，但增长还是慢得让人着急，问题到底出在哪儿？

If you're putting out consistent episodes and the growth still feels slow, what's actually going wrong?

根据Signal Hill Insights的一项新研究——《播客地图》，他们调查了五千多名听众，得出了答案。

Well, according to new research from Signal Hill Insights in a study called Podcast Atlas, which surveyed 5,000 plus listeners.

我们其实已经有了一个相当明确的答案，而且这个答案还很有商业价值。

We've got a pretty good answer to this and sounds profitable.

这个答案是由汤姆·韦伯斯特在最近一场网络研讨会上清晰讲出来的。

And the legend that is Tom Webster delivered that clear answer to us in a recent webinar.

而我的任务就是替你把这场研讨看完，我也确实看完了。

And it was my job to watch it for you, which is what I've done.

接下来这一期，我们就来聊聊这个内容。

And that's what this episode is about.

结果发现，你的节目只是在运转整个增长系统中的一个环节，而这个系统其实需要四到五个部分协同作用才行。

And your episode, it turns out, is doing one job in a system that needs four or five things working together in order to grow.

今天我们要聊的是其中三个关键点，以及你该怎么应对。

Today, we're gonna talk about three of those things and what to do about them.

播客洞察。

Podcasting insights.

你好。

Hello.

你正在收听的是《PodMastery播客洞察》。

You're listening to podmastery podcasting insights.

我是尼尔·瓦列霍，Podnose播客的创始人，有二十五年广播和音频行业经验。

I'm Neil Vallejo, founder of Podnose podcasting, twenty five years in radio and audio.

在过去的这些年里，我一直和像你这样的独立播客合作，帮助弥合技术上合格的节目和真正能打动听众的节目之间的差距。

And for the last several of those, I've been working with independent podcasters like you on the gap between the show that sounds technically right and one that actually does something for the people listening.

在深入探讨这项研究的具体内容和我的看法之前，我想先说一句：每次有市场调研或研究报告出来，都该这么看待。

Well, first of all, before we get into the nitty gritty of what's in this study and my take on it, I wanna just preface it by telling you every time some market research or a study comes out, it should be treated thusly.

这只是一份市场调研数据。

It's one piece of market research.

并不意味着你应该据此彻底改变所有做法。

It doesn't mean its findings should lead to you overhauling how you do everything.

明白吗？

Okay?

我过去一直很明确地指出，短视频片段对扩大播客听众规模的效果有限。

And I have been quite vocal in the past about the lack of efficacy that podcast clips can have for growing your podcast.

在本集节目中，我依然会坚持这个观点。

Now I'm gonna maintain that throughout this entire episode.

清楚吗？

Alright?

听起来我好像自相矛盾，但其实并没有。

It's gonna sound like I'm contradicting myself, but I'm really not.

我坚持认为，在社交媒体上发布播客片段，大概率不会让你在苹果播客或Spotify上获得新听众。

I am maintaining podcast clips on social media are probably not going to grow your audience in Apple Podcasts or Spotify.

现在我把这点说清楚了，咱们来看看这项研究里最亮眼的数据。

Now that I've got that out of the way, let's talk about the best stat in this whole study.

77% 的音频播客听众都会全神贯注地听。

77% of audio podcast listeners give it their full or near full attention.

只有 5% 的人把它当背景音，而 43% 的人对最喜欢的播客主持人信任程度，不亚于对朋友的信任。

Only 5% treat it as background noise, and 43% trust their favorite podcast host as much as they would a friend.

这简直太惊人了，没有任何其他平台能接近这样的数据。

Now that's incredible, and no other platform comes even close to those numbers.

你能想象有 43% 的 LinkedIn 好友会像信任朋友一样信任你吗？

Can you imagine 43% of your LinkedIn followers trusting you as much as a friend?

但这里有个关键点，很多独立播客主就算看了这份研究，也容易忽略。

But here's the bit that most indie podcasters are gonna miss with this study even if they looked at it.

这种信任只有在听众已经开始听之后才会建立，而音频才是整个生态中最能建立深度关系的媒介。

That trust only kicks in once somebody is already listening, and audio is the deepest relationship builder in the whole ecosystem.

不过，重点来了，研究就在这里发挥作用。

But, and here's where the study comes in.

关键不在于人们最初是怎么找到你的。

It's not how people are finding you in the first place.

如果你以为音频节目既能帮你被发现，又能建立信任，那你就搞错了，因为这两件事根本是两码事，音频只擅长其中一项——建立信任。

If you've been expecting your audio episodes to do the discovery work as well as the trust work, that they say is the problem because those are two different jobs, and audio is only built for one of them for the trust piece.

接下来要说的这一点，可能根据你的立场会有些争议。

And here we come on to the bit that could be slightly contentious depending on your viewpoint.

实际上，人们是通过短视频片段找到你的。

Clips are apparently how people actually find you.

这些数据真的很难反驳。

And I will say the numbers are quite hard to argue with.

明白了。

Okay.

高达89%的播客听众会在社交媒体上观看短视频片段。

So 89% of podcast listeners watch clips on social media.

这是对五千多名听众调查得出的结果。

That is the finding of this survey of 5,000 plus listeners.

81%的人表示，短视频曾促使他们至少偶尔去观看某一期完整节目，84%的人说这些短视频让他们成了节目的固定听众。从数据上看，这根本不是可有可无的事。

81% say clips have led them to watch a specific episode at least sometimes, and 84% say clips have turned them into a regular listener of a show On paper, that means it's not a nice to have.

短视频才是完整的引流链条。

It's the whole discovery pipeline clips.

大多数独立播客主要么根本不做短视频，要么就是偶尔、断断续续地做一下。

Now most indie podcasters either don't clip at all or do it occasionally and infrequently.

我们实在没时间。

We just don't have the time.

我们都很忙。

We're busy.

我们本来就已经在忙着制作这些内容了。

We're making this content in the first place.

我们哪还有多余的一两个小时，每周坐下来挑出适合社交媒体传播的精彩片段呢？

We certainly don't have an extra hour or two every week to sit down and find exceptional bits of content that would do well on a social media platform.

但根据这项研究，事实就是如此——我再强调一遍。

But the truth is, according to this research, again, I am making that clear.

这项研究显示，你的潜在听众正在刷YouTube、TikTok和Instagram，但他们找不到你，因为你根本没在这些平台留下任何痕迹。

This research well, your potential audience is scrolling YouTube, TikTok, and Instagram, and not finding you because there's nothing of you to fight.

所以，你得诚实地问自己一个问题：

So the honest question worth asking yourself is this.

你上一次从你的节目里剪出一段内容，发到那些还没听过你的人可能会看到的地方，是什么时候？

When did you last clip something from your show and put it somewhere that people who don't already listen to you might actually find it.

因为如果答案是很少或从没做过，那根据这项研究，你其实是在关掉漏斗最顶端的流量入口。

Because if the answer is rarely or never, then according to this, you might be switching off the top of your funnel.

还有数据里另一点值得注意。

One more thing from the data that's worth flagging.

对于年轻听众来说，竖屏视频不只是一个发现节目的渠道。

For younger audiences specifically, vertical video isn't just a discovery channel.

它就是最主要的发现渠道。

It is the discovery channel.

他们日常就活在这些平台里。

It's where they're living.

人们一旦知道你存在了，才会去用播客应用。

The podcast apps come way later once somebody already knows you exist.

不过咱们得说清楚一点。

Let's make it quite clear, though.

我们刚才提到的所有平台——Spotify、Apple、YouTube、Instagram、TikTok，这些都只是租来的地盘。

Every channel we've just talked about, so that's Spotify, there's Apple, there's YouTube, there's Instagram, TikTok, all of that is rented land.

Apple Podcasts 也是租来的地盘。

Apple Podcasts is rented land.

你真正拥有的，是你的 RSS 订阅源。

Your RSS feed is what you own.

算法一变，平台一改，账号一被封，你就全没了。

So the algorithm changes, the platform pivots, your account gets suspended.

这种事已经发生过很多次了，以后还会继续发生。

It's happened to people, and it'll keep happening.

如果 Apple Podcast 决定拒绝你的 RSS 订阅源，这种事过去确实发生过，比如亚历克斯·琼斯就遇到过。

So if Apple Podcast decides to reject your RSS feed, which we know has happened to big names in the past, Alex Jones being one of them.

那可就真走到头了，不是吗？

Well, that's end of the road, isn't it?

除非你打算一被平台封了RSS，就得从零开始重建。

Unless you wanna start from scratch the moment that your RSS feed gets booted out of any platform.

不管你多看重这个RSS，一旦被踢出平台，你就再也访问不到了。

Doesn't matter how much you own that RSS feed, you cannot access that rented land.

但邮件通讯就不一样了。

The newsletter is different.

那是你自己的东西。

It's yours.

它就像你的RSS一样。

It's like your RSS feed.

在你和听众之间，没有任何算法横在中间，而且数据也证实了这一点。

There is no algorithm sitting between you and your listener, and the data is backing this up.

有87%的播客听众表示，订阅邮件通讯后，至少偶尔会因此回到播客节目。

87% of podcast listeners who subscribe to a newsletter say it's led them back to a podcast episode at least sometimes.

只有39%的播客听众会订阅任何电子报。

Only 39% of podcast listeners subscribe to any newsletter at all.

这意味着有61%的听众还处于未开发状态，随时可以转化为你自己的受众。

So that means 61% are sitting there as an untapped ownable audience waiting to be converted.

尤其是独立创作者，一定要在做播客的同时建立邮件列表。

And for indie creators especially, building that email list alongside your show isn't optional.

这相当于一份保险，能让你在其他渠道都失效时仍有保障。

It is the insurance policy you now have against everything else not doing its job.

我再强调一次。

Now I'm gonna maintain once again.

电子报，必须做。

Newsletter, absolutely.

RSS源，必不可少。

RSS feed, must.

播客片段算是锦上添花。

Podcast clips are nice to have.

如果你的目标只是扩大音频播客的听众，那短视频可帮不上忙，至少不会直接起作用。

If if your sole purpose is to grow your audio podcast because the clips are not gonna do that, at least not directly.

就连调查数据也支持这个观点。

Even the survey findings back that point up.

大多数人是在其他地方先发现节目，之后才去播客应用里找的。

Most people are finding shows in other places and then looking in the podcast apps once they've made that connection.

如果你想打造一个恰好也放了播客内容的YouTube频道，那当然没问题。

If you wanna grow a YouTube channel that happens to have that podcast content duplicated into it, great.

尽管去做吧。

Have at it.

短视频确实能起到辅助作用。

The clips will help.

YouTube Shorts本来就是干这个的。

That's what YouTube shorts were invented for.

TikTok也是这么做的，但别把音频增长当成主要目标。

That's what TikTok does as its job, but remove the audio as the goal from this.

所以情况就是这样。

So there we are.

三件事。

Three jobs.

音频的作用是在听众开始收听后建立信任。

Audio does the trust work once someone's listening.

根据这份报告，短视频负责在听众收听前吸引他们的注意，而通讯简报则能让你始终掌握关系，不管平台怎么改规则。

Clips, according to this, do the discovery work before they're even listening, and the newsletter keeps the relationship yours regardless of what the platforms decide to do.

你不需要一下子把所有这些都做起来。

You don't need to do all of this at once.

但如果你只做其中一项，还纳闷为什么增长这么慢，那这些建议可值得好好想想，对吧？

But if you're only doing one of them and wondering why your growth is slower than you'd like, well, this is food for thought, isn't it?

你可以去看看完整的《播客地图》报告。

You can go check out the full Podcast Atlas report.

免费的。

It's free.

非常值得一看，链接在节目简介里。

It's well worth a read, and you'll find the link to it in the episode description.

希望这期节目对你有帮助。

I hope you found this episode useful.

如果觉得有用，推荐给其他你也认识的播客创作者，他们一直对播客干货很感兴趣。

If you did, share it with another podcaster you know is always interested in podcasting insights.

在这期间，等下一期之前，祝你在通往播客高手的路上一切顺利。

In the meantime, until the next episode, good luck with your continuing journey to attaining podmastery.